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  1. #46
    Do you ever leave? paulzig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty2 View Post

    Any more personal attacks will get this thread locked
    But its so much fun

  2. #47
    Do you ever leave? HQ308Ute's Avatar
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    It's completely false that big business creates jobs.. The spenders create employment.. you and me.

  3. #48
    Do you ever leave? immortality's Avatar
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    Completely agree about the casualisation of the workforce, it's making the business owners rich(er) but hurting most others. The free market capitalist model we currently have is killing our countries where a few get rich and most others work more for a share of less than before. Huge conglomerates are killing competition and we are heading in a direction where soon we won't be ruled by governments (of the people for the people) but rather by business alone.

  4. #49
    Do you ever leave? HQ308Ute's Avatar
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    Agreed.. conglomerates are actually the job killers.. they don't like competition, that's why they enjoy running the country down with stagnant wages and removing net funds from the economy like dissolving penalty rates.. they're only interested in cuts so they can reinvest into the free market economy where their profits go up at the expense of productivity. We foot the bill for their profits without actually gaining any asset ourselves.
    When people have money to spend.. and borrow.. that creates new firms that are innovative, grow rapidly and become a wellspring of job and economic growth.. if not they fail and exit and make room for allowing capital to be put to more productive uses.
    If you dont understand this then you've never had a successful business.
    The liberals have just become addicted to corporate cocaine.
    Last edited by HQ308Ute; 16-05-2019 at 10:57 AM.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by GtoGeoff View Post
    Mickey Juice,

    You have obviously been on the juice again. Heard of 17% interest rates? The highest ever in this country. We can thank the Hawke Labor govt for that & the master treasure Paul Keating of 'Banana republic' & 'The recession we had to have' fame. Rudd/Gillard's BER & pink bats, 4 deaths. Millions wasted because no checks on how taxpayers money was being spent. Cheques sent to dead people. Yeah, great money managers. Wayne Swan, the worlds ' greatest' treasurer who never delivered the promised surplus & left a HUGE debt. The NBN plan written on the back of postcard, STARTED by Labor & would have been too costly & wasteful to abandon by the incoming Abbott govt.

    If you studied politics, you didn't learn much. If you want employees [ ie, people that have jobs ], you have to have an employer FIRST. Labor attacks big business, too stupid to realise that big businesses create jobs & creates work [ employment ] for small businesses. Coalition are not my 'mates', never said they were. I won't be voting for them. The unemployment rate is lower now than under Labor, or maybe you think high unemployment is good.... When Whitlam got in, unemployment & inflation soared. You left that bit out.....You are full of bull shit.
    Geoff I think you might find that the 17% interest rates were not confined to Australia and were a world wide phenomenon. I could be wrong as it was a fair while ago but I believe they were brought about by a sharp rise in the price of oil. I do remember people having their houses repossessed by the banks, they were heartless. I was so glad when they had a royal commission into the banks and also the reluctance of the LNP to set it in place. They were also pretty quick to shut it off.
    I think that we make a mistake when we think we are electing a party into power when in fact we are electing them to office. It is big business who run the show. Only in the socialist countries like the old USSR was the government in power.
    In 1984 the Labour government in NZ were swept into office in a landslide. That was back in the day prior to exchange rates being floated. The previous prime minister refused to devalue the dollar. As a result of this the incoming government had to do it. In between time the people with the money sent their money overseas and made an instant profit of 20% when they brought it back in. If the currency had not been devalued the country would have gone bankrupt. The government could do nothing about it. That's the difference between being in power and being in office.
    Like you Geoff I remember when we had full employment. The company I served my apprenticeship with could not get anyone for love nor money. The employers had to be nice or they could have built the buildings on their own. My parents put a pound deposit on a new house and forfeited the child benefit and lived happily ever after. My mother never worked, we only had one car, she never learned to drive. My mother in law has never driven a car as her family was in the same situation. They did not live the life of Riley but we managed ok.
    I believe the start of our demise was through our borrowing of money from the international monetary fund. They demanded that we have a certain level of unemployment and dictated how we would run our economy.
    It has not helped with this governments neoliberal policies. The idea that if the rich get richer then they in turn will pass it on to the poor is laughable. I have recently seen a listing of the 50 richest people in Australia. The poorest had 730 million dollars and worked up to 14 billion dollars. How much do they need to live? Surely this money could be put to better use.
    I am not a Trump fan but I do like his putting tariffs on other countries. Free trade agreements only work when you have a level playing field. That we can compete with China where they pay their people the same amount in a month as we do in a day is a joke.
    As for inflation rates having been 17%. If Iran and Saudi Arabia go to war it is predicted that oil could rise to $330 dollars a barrel then 17% inflation might not look to bad. Bring on affordable electric cars so we can dodge this bullet.

  6. #51
    Do you ever leave? immortality's Avatar
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    Free trade agreements are a joke, we basically have open borders but trade with China is not free it is just that they have reduced the tariffs we now pay but they still put up plenty of barriers to free trade and if we as a nation do something to upset them then suddenly containers of perishable products end up sitting on the wharf because some paper work isn't correct. Recently we aggravated the Chinese and and Air NZ flight that was half way to china was turned around because suddenly they didn't have landing permits.

  7. #52
    casual poster mousey's Avatar
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    No Career politicians two terms max then out . No benefits the taxpayers have had enough. Stop voting them in. We need real people not Career politicians

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by HQ308Ute View Post
    Agreed.. conglomerates are actually the job killers.. they don't like competition, that's why they enjoy running the country down with stagnant wages and removing net funds from the economy like dissolving penalty rates.. they're only interested in cuts so they can reinvest into the free market economy where their profits go up at the expense of productivity. We foot the bill for their profits without actually gaining any asset ourselves.
    When people have money to spend.. and borrow.. that creates new firms that are innovative, grow rapidly and become a wellspring of job and economic growth.. if not they fail and exit and make room for allowing capital to be put to more productive uses.
    If you dont understand this then you've never had a successful business.
    The liberals have just become addicted to corporate cocaine.
    Its happened to our auto parts industry, everyone has been bought out by BAPCOR (Burson) or GPC Asia Pacific (Repco) - what happens is they collect data of part numbers and purchases from their chain in an area, offer a stupidly low buy-out to any independent businesses in the area under threat of opening a branch there, if they don't accept the offer the branch goes in and they run it at a loss until they take all the independents customers and they close doors, then the prices get hiked up.

    They're both super aggressive corporate monsters.

  9. #54
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    Aah, election years.

    Where the ants argue whether the left boot or right is better and forget that being stood on by either results in the same outcome.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by GtoGeoff View Post
    You have obviously been on the juice again. Heard of 17% interest rates? The highest ever in this country.
    Another inconvenient truth for you GtoGeoff. In 1982 I seem to remember an interest rate of 21.4% here in Australia (the highest ever recorded). From another poor performing government like the one we currently have.
    If memory serves me correctly the treasurer at the time was John Howard.

    It took the next government two years to get them down to 19% and by the time they were removed from office somewhere just under 8%. These are the RBA rates.

    Feel free to fact check and get back to me with your retort..... I'm sure it will be as interesting as the rest of your mis-information LMFAO
    Last edited by HQ 368; 16-05-2019 at 08:30 PM.

  11. #56
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    HQ You caught my attention. Wow 21%. I remember my parents struggling with their home loan. They actually had to sell the house they had built and we moved in with my grandparents. I was 15 at the time. 1987. It had a profound impact on me. I did some research. Prior to 1990 the RBA did not set a target cash rate (commonly referred to as RBA interest rate). So the only data pre 1990 was the standard variable home loan rate. Which is tracked back to 1959. The peak in both those (cash/interest rate and standard variable rate) was 17.5% in 1990. It never got close to 21%

    https://www.rba.gov.au/statistics/cash-rate/

    https://www.loansense.com.au/historical-rates.html

    I agree with you in what Hawke did in the earlier 90s to get the rates down. What’s surprising is he was re-elected at the height of the worst rated in our history

    And funny we are talking about him right now. He just passed away today

    I’m a conservative voter but he did a lot of good for our country that led to a great era of prosperity through the 90s and 00s
    Chris

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  12. #57
    been here .......too long Smitty2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HQ 368 View Post
    Another inconvenient truth for you GtoGeoff. In 1982 I seem to remember an interest rate of 21.4% here in Australia (the highest ever recorded). From another poor performing government like the one we currently have.
    If memory serves me correctly the treasurer at the time was John Howard.
    ................
    Everyone forgets that you will still pay that interest rate (about 21%) ....on your credit card if you don't pay it off in full.
    And lots do ...

    The Hayne Banking Royal commission did not get a chance to look at interest rates and the arbitrage games
    the banks play.. unfortunately
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  13. #58
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    Remember that it doesn't need to be just 2 parties

    https://youtu.be/bleyX4oMCgM

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty2 View Post
    Everyone forgets that you will still pay that interest rate (about 21%) ....on your credit card if you don't pay it off in full.
    And lots do ...

    The Hayne Banking Royal commission did not get a chance to look at interest rates and the arbitrage games
    the banks play.. unfortunately
    Not me of course but a cynic might say that the commission was cut short deliberately.

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by cluxford View Post
    It never got close to 21%
    Just google "1982 RBA prime interest rate" or something similar, you'll find it. Actually says it peaked in June 1982 at 21.5%
    You'll find articles on it as well. Also interviews where journalists have put it to old Johnny about the highest interest rates in Australian history while he was Treasurer and he attempts to change the subject or dodge the issue. He never has denied it though, so I give him that.

    Didn't take much to find these

    https://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/...arlton/comment

    https://johnquiggin.com/2004/09/30/i...he-lost-years/

    https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/the-i...05-gdr9mx.html

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