ProVK

Throwing around a few ideas about different fuels in my 355ci Turbo Holden V8 with EFI in My VK Calais.

It's apart at the monent getting a roll cage, bigger roller cam and a M800 Motec ECU with some bigger injectors to keep the fuel up to it. It was making 500rwhp thru the glide and 5000rpm converter, but the injectors maxed out before 5000rpm so the timing had to be pulled right back to keep the mixtures safe. That was on 11psi.

Now im planning on running 15-17psi with heaps of fuel available on 98 octane. But i am also looking at trying some race fuel to see what it can really make and also to let me make the tune nice and safe whilst still make good power.

I have a few options

Sunnoco GT Plus - $4 to $7 a litre depending on how much i buy, too expensive for the street.

E85 Ethanol/Petrol Blend, Advertised as 105 octane but reported to be nearly 110. Just a little hard to buy atm, but cheap at around $1.30 litre, but use more.

Or go full methanol, will have to run bigger injectors, but could nearly throw away the cooler, cheap at $1 litre even if you nearly use twice as much, easy to buy in 205l drums, could probaly get away running it on the street. Would have to swap injectors and change tunes to run on 98 octane if i wanted to street drive it.

What do people think ?

PVE

I would need to do some more research...... = E85 about 35% more fuel required, so fuel system must be up to it.

Methanol.... large injectors may make it ordinary on the street.

ProVK

E85 sounds like the go too, just need to find somewhere to buy it, im happy to buy 205l at a time as it is cheaper than 98.

greenhj

as luck would have it, theres a biofuel distributor not five minutes from my house.

Im going there tomorrow for a msds and whatever data they can give me, e85 on mine for some testing coming soon.

any questions from the masses that need asking?

I figure youve got an hour lol.

ProVK

I spose Octane Ratings, Shelf Life, Can we buy it in drums, price etc

greenhj

if they dont use monkeys behind the counter, i should have the info tomorrow.

moot

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some guys are running upto 16:1 comp asp. and the turbo guys reckon you can run the same boost as c16.... i have a servo 2 minutes away from work

TK383

The other option you've missed is using pump 98 with 20% toluene - available in 20L drums pretty cheap.
Poor mans race fuel, the turbo import guys swear by it - I'll be using it in the tonner when I get it up & running (only for racing).

But this e85 stuff sounds good - a bit of a report on how it goes would be appreciated if you go that way.

ProVK

I have heard about E85 being compared to C16 also.

Sounds like to may be the way to go.

greenhj

ph-not available
vapur pressure-44mm Hg @ 20c
boiling point 78C
melting point -117c
specific gravity 0.79-0.81 (NO TEMPERATURE GIVEN)
flash point 13c
upper explosion limit 19%
lower explosion limit 3.5%

C2-H6-O (ethyl alcohol)

Please note these figures are for 100% ETHANOL, the guy at the fuel place tells me he doesnt blend it yet to e85 spec, and theres no plans to till next year but would quite "happily" sell a 200l drum of the stuff (100%) if you provide your own clean drum.

Mobil provides the fuel to him and he cuts it to E10 out the pumps.

Price is not known yet for a drum of pure ethanol or blended to e85 spec, he reckons im the first to ask him about the stuff and wondered why i'd want it.

He also claims that next year ALL 91 octane at the pump will be replaced by E10 (95 octane)

pure ethyl alcohol will biodegrade (probably) to acetic acid and formaldehyde (both REAL handy for your health, and your engine lol) and will photodegrade in air with a half life measured in hours for polluted air, to days in clean air.

Sorry I couldnt be of more help, Ill speak to head office now to find out more.

greenhj

I also have a source for DECENT 100 octane e20 off the shelf and easy to get (not the now defunct shell crap)

Price compares favourably to 98 pump and is probably what I will end up using.

Surly

ProVK,

From memory you are an ANDRA racer so you will need to use an approved fuel. Methanol is obviously not a problem. Not sure where E85 stands. 98 with toluene is out the window.

If your current injectors are maxed out will you be able to flow more than two times that? Will you be able to get enough pump to supply twice the volume at efi pressures?

The other issue is cleaning the methanol out of the fuel system after use. Not sure how friendly or unfriendly it is to injectors but even in a mechanical injection system it makes a bloody mess if not cleaned out very promptly.

There was a 41 Willys here in Perth with a supercharged 392 hemi that went down the blown EFI path with little success for a few seasons then gave up and went back to mechanical injection.

Interested to see how you go

cheers
Surly

ProVK

No more info Green on the E85 ?

allports

.79-.81 is a wide range for an alk based fuel. Methanol is .792 @ STD Air so they quote higher?? Seems odd. On the hottest of days at the track and numerous hours stranded in the staging lanes at willowbank a few years ago we were hauled in for a fuel test and the fuel was up to 26dC after being super heated on the tarmac waiting for oil downs and a crash clean up, the Spec grav was .7866 which equates to a weight of 6.5650 lb/USg which is a life time away from .792 with a weight of 6.61 lb/USg
Just seems something isnt right there. That quoted .81 is way off the mark afaic
For those wanting to know Ethanol needs to be 60% richer where Alcohol needs to be 130% richer when you compare
And if anyone wants any numbers on Nitro or mixes of that funny yellow stuff Pm me.

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greenhj

no more info yet unfortunately, cant stray too far from home at the moment lol.

Sean, the info above is straight off their paperwork, I also found the S.G. stuff "odd".

fark knows lol.